Stars too old to be trusted?

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jim</i>
<br />It would be interesting to see what kind of evolution you would get using the MM concepts.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Very interesting, but also a lot of work.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The theory of evolution is great for life on Earth but do stars really evolve and if they do how they do?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Stars must evolve because they start life in giant molecular clouds and end it in explosions. Saying how they evolve requires knowing the basics of stellar interiors. In a recent MRB, Robitaille proposed that the Sun is actually in a liquid state rather than a gaseous one. Getting that part right is a prerequisite to getting the evolution model right, and almost everything else we might want to know about stars with it. -|Tom|-

Jim, let's talk about some processes that can build and break atoms without the need for fusion or fission. These radioactive decay processes are well-documented and could be food for thought in this thread.

1. Alpha decay - in alpha decay an unstable heavy nuclei sheds two protons (p+) and two neutrons (nº). This is effectively the nucleus of a helium atom, and is in fact the major source of helium for balloons and such on earth. A classic example being the transmutation of uranium in the earth, the final byproducts being Lead (Pb) and Helium (He). Alpha decay causes the loss of atomic number. I mention this because new elements are formed and mass is converted into energy adding some heat to the surrounding earth, albeit nothing close to nuclear fisssion or fusion.

2. Beta Decay - in Beta decay (and this is very interesting to me as a means of getting odd numbered elements especially) an unstable nucleus applies weak nuclear forces to a neutron causing it to emit a B- particle. (I am not prepared to talk about positron emission at this point so I will focus on electron emission). When the B- particle is emitted the neutron is changed into a proton, this effectively increases the element's atomic number resulting in a new element with an increase in protons from the parent element.

These two processes can help explain the presence of elements between Hydrogen and Iron (the traditional elements created during fusion) and the variety of heavy elements between stable nuclei that are theorized to be created during supernova.


Mark Vitrone

The process of making stars from clouds must begin somewhere and by that I mean where did the cloud come from? Making atoms from protons is done but where does the proton come from? Neutron stars would beta decay into proton stars or not and then what do you have? Evolution is a process of change in structure and stars don't change. Stars might age but even that is not likely because mass alone determines what kind of star it is. So, saying this star is old and that star is makes no sense at all.