The entropy of systems

<i>Originally posted by Jim</i>
<br />Sun spots are supposed to be windows into the sun according to someone that ponders these kind of topics. So, what is the spot made of? Is it composed of something other than the surface it is floating on?
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Jim

the thing is,that it is dark,but why,and why the depth of darkness(there is no light) and does this make sense in our way of thinking?

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
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<i>Originally posted by north</i>
<br />need i say more Tom?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">About what? Your questions and comments are very difficult to understand. Of what relevance is your comment to your previous question, if any? -|Tom|-
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sometimes Tom it's the way you come across. there are blackspots( even if we don't see the whole picture,you failed to mention that the gases are cooler than the surface(but why would the photoshere be hotter than the interior? does this actually make sense, i mean you would think the opposite),have we any photos that actually look into the spot it's self, i mean right into it.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by north</i>
<br />there are blackspots<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">No, there are only spots that look black when images are rendered so that the human eye can process them. In reality, those spots are thousands of degrees and white hot. There are no spots that are really black, meaning giving off little or no light.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">you failed to mention that the gases are cooler than the surface<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">[tvf, previous message]: "So we see them as black, even though they are merely a bit less hot, white, and bright than the photosphere."

Note that "less hot" means cooler. And sunspots are part of the surface. They are cooler than the surrounding photosphere.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">(but why would the photoshere be hotter than the interior?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">We cannot <i>see</i> the interior, only the surface. But we can use other techniques to infer what's just below the surface.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">have we any photos that actually look into the spot it's self, i mean right into it.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Yes, many. That is a common task for solar telescopes. See article and video at news-service.stanford.edu/news/2001/november7/sunspot-117.html I'm sure an internet search would turn up actual photos. -|Tom|-

P.S. I see you have as much trouble understanding me as I do you.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by north</i>
<br />how do you explain the "blackness" phenomena in Sun spots?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The human eye is able to adjust to an enormous range of brightness levels. Some type of cameras can emulate its technique. The eye does this adjustment by rendering the brightest lights in our field of vision to an arbitrary "maximum intensity" level, usually all-white (representing all wavelengths). It then reduces all other lights to dimmer levels, making them appear more gray or black. Usually, the dimmest objects in our field of vision appear all-black.

In image processing, this is called "adjusting the contrast". The smaller the difference between the brightest and dimmest objects in our field of vision, the greater is the number of different shades of gray (or levels of dimness) that we can discern.

Sunspots are actually very hot, very bright, and rather red parts of the solar photosphere, as is obvious when they are photographed in isolation from the surrounding photosphere. But they are dimmer than the light around them. So we see them as black, even though they are merely a bit less hot, white, and bright than the photosphere. -|Tom|-
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Maybe the reason the sun has hotter surface temperatures is due to electromagnetic surface tensions from the inward forces of gravity that cause friction from the streaming of higher dimensional outpouring of energy and fusion processes, and the sun spots are vortical structures that are more dense and direct both inwards and outwards arched electromagnetic flux densities that radiate energies in bursts rather than in a streaming constant flow. Also, energy dynamics are both entropic and non-entropic at times dependent upon electromagnetic fields and dimensional stresses from Matter and Anti-Matter Universes. Just because a sun could potentially end up as a Black Hole, does not mean that this Solar storm system that was once radiating light and is now pulling in light towards its center has become entropic. I would say that guit to the contrary that systems do not necessarily evolve towards an entropic state, they just change form and are still very energetic. A black hole still outpours a focused vortex of Antimatter and shoots out very energetic beams of X-Rays, and produces Gamma Ray Bursts in great clouds of Antimatter anihilations. I would have to say that the state of any atomic system does not necessarily degenerate towards a non-energetic state, and that the precursor to regenerating any given field is the dynamics of the gravitational forces interacting with the electromagnetic shielding. John

North,

July's issue of National Geographic has an article on the subject: "living with a stormy star". They mention that sunspots are created when magnetic field lines are disrupted from an uneven rotation of the sun's upper layers and burst through the convection zone (which ends about 200 000 km below the surface, where the radiation zone starts)

Another article in "Science & Vie" indicates that the disruption of a sunspot in the convection zone extends 24 000 km below the surface.

Much of this information is extrapolated from data received from SOHO, the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory launched by the European Space Agency and Nasa in 1995.

The N.G. article mentions that the magnetism of the sunspot keeps the plasma below it cool and blocks hot rising plasma.

The "Science & Vie" article mentions that the photosphere may reach temperatures of approx. 6000 K and the corona approx. 1000 000 K.

Also quoted in this article "The superheated gases that form the sun, mainly hydrogen and helium, exist in an electrified state called plasma."

My question is: How and why is the atom transformed into plasma and produce such mayhem ?
Is gravity produced by the atom, or is it applied to the atom? or both?

O.k. I hear you guys laugh from here. The corona of the sun is at a higher entropy than the surface. But this is because the plasma in that area is in an excited state, and this goes along with what I am trying to convey.

The major point about this theory is that the amount of free (potential) energy in the atom decreases with time. It also decreases as it tends towards the center of a body or system.

Less potential energy in the atom means more energy (heat) in its surroundings.
The only place, I am assuming, where this is not the case is at the very center of the galaxy or a massive star where all motion abruptly falls to almost zero.
At that point the atom is all but obliterated by the pressure (maybe no atoms at all?).

I wonder if this could be verified: the temperature at the point where the light-speed jet of particles which is being expelled at the center of the galaxy, should be much cooler than its surroundings.
In other words: there should be, at a very short distance from each other, the lowest and the highest entropy regions of the galaxy.